Sylvester Stallone and His Friends' Films Podcast

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so
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[Music]
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so [Music]
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welcome to it's a long road the ramble series podcast doug from the rocky minute podcast he is
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guest starting with me today how are you doing doug guest starring wow makes me sound a lot more important than
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i actually am but dude thanks for having me you're a true pleasure a true joy in real life and you know you're a guest
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star in my life so maybe maybe one day we'll uh you know the stars will align and we'll actually meet
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in real life i know i definitely want to see you and meet you in person uh you and craig are you like my brothers and
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one day because i know once we do get together it's just going to be like we've always known each other it's just going to be a natural
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weird world of you know meeting people online and back in the day back when we were kids this wasn't a thing like you
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didn't know like that we had pen pals never remember pen pals oh yeah you just trying to find a young girl to write
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that was all yeah it never worked out that way though it was wrote to some uh you know some other
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kid from um i don't know germany or something i wonder how many pen pals even back then were creepy 55 year old
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men writing kids that's you know what it's probably more of a reality than than we even know
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oh man well doug we are now tackling the rambo franchise what does the ramble
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franchise mean to you well rambo was always like the anti-rocky to me i was
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far more of a rocky fan than a ramble fan growing up and you know i apologize to to show my my hand so early in your
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podcast i was always a rocky fan much more than a rambo fan i've seen the rambos plenty of times
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including first blood but he was like the anti-rocky he you know rocky was a wholesome character rambo was this
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violent personally tormented although as a kid i didn't i didn't really see into his psyche like that but just a violent
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dude you know and i liked the rockies and the rambos for two completely different reasons you know as a kid sure
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it's interesting because stallone plays both characters i can't and i guess that's often why people compare the two
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characters because it's like well stallone plays both characters so it's automatically and both are franchises one has five one has including the creed
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films eight films take away the kree films one has six rocky films that star rocky the character and then of course
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five ramble films so very comparable in their journey the times that they were released the mirroring of stallone's
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popular culture status it's very interesting to talk about all those things we're on this journey on this
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long road wasn't it always two with the rambos and the rockies they were always released starting now in the same year
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first blood and rocky iii were released in 82 and then rambo three no first blood part
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two and rocky iv were released in 85. am i right boy now you're putting me to the yeah
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this guy doesn't know his the release dates or the ramblers i know i know first play was 82 yes
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first by part two i believe yeah was 85 i think three that's off top of my head was 88
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part four was 2008 and then part five okay 2019. i'm i'm way off then
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because not way off but rocky four was 85 so that right and first
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world part two coincide but then rocky five was 90. yeah and then ramble through 88. so it's still kind of a
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close enough close enough yeah before you get into the movie one other thing about stallone himself the way he
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plays these two characters also displays his ability as an actor to play two completely
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different characters i mean they do share certain similarities on rocky minute we always just praised stallone
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for his nonverbal acting and rambo i mean in his solitary scenes and
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at least this movie very little dialogue he does have some great nonverbal facial
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acting in that ways the characters are somewhat i mean it's not the characters it's stallone the way he plays them but it
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definitely shows his range the differences between the two well i know you've heard my interview with david
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morale the author and creator phenomenal interview you know how craig always says you have the
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bill conte interview i would say you have the pinnacle david morrell interview also well that's very kind of
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you i only bring it up because well because i'm amazing hell they bring it up because
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well you got him to share very personal stuff that he admitted to never speaking of before i don't know where that came
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from man i'm like for those who want to see it was actually a video recording so i put it on my new youtube channel for
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it's a long world the ramble series podcast i have no subscribers at this time but the video's there so my first video
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on my podcast is the the video version of me mr morrell and you can see in his face and yeah near the end he was i mean
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holding back crying with the story that he was sharing and i was just like holy smokers i don't know why we're here
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it's you and the way you allow your guests to really open up you know by the way you present the interview it's like
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a conversation it's not like an interview i appreciate that i don't mean to blow smoke up your ass it's that's
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totally not like oh yeah yeah i know i appreciate it and so mr morrell he spoke to sly's acting that's why i bring it up
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because he talked about how and i never thought of it this way and i'm really glad he brought up that sly in this film
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a lot of the acting has to do with the eyes so when we watch this let's look for and those who watch the movies with
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me during this journey let's look for sly's eyes the sly's eyes and this is
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uh yeah the sly watch yes i watch so anyways uh the acting he does with his
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eyes and i can see it totally now with that sequence of course with the fingerprinting just how he doesn't say anything but what are your emotes
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physically yeah is amazing he and he has two different distinct looks like he has that when his eyes are
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kind of droopy and he's just in like quiet contemplation and then when he's manic his eyes go really wide yeah when
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he's doing something that's crazy yeah it's like driving the truck when he's driving a truck through the blockade and
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everything sorry to jump ahead but how dare you but that's what i noticed about his eyes
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well no before we get into our scenes in the movie because that's actually not well it's not the majority of the show
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but when i have a guest on especially when it's your first time on the show i do want to hear more about your thoughts on rambo uh the character and the film
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first blood but you said you hadn't seen it in a while and you said that you originally wanted to put the film in just to kind of see
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the sequences that we'd be talking about just so it's fresh in your mind which is totally fair but then you ended up watching the whole
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thing that's first blood man yeah it draws you in as a kid growing up i saw
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rambo 2 a lot more than i saw this just because it was more action for a kid just the same reason why i saw rocky iv
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more than i saw the original right growing up i found this movie as a kid kind of boring because it has slow
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moments the action pieces are tremendous but you have to wade through a lot of slowness to get to those but rambo as a
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character now it's like i said as a kid i saw him as a violent person just like
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to shoot people exploding arrows and blowing [ __ ] up and everything and it and on the surface
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that's what rambo is but when you cut through that and get into the whole him actually
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personally suffering and that's his true character he's just a guy that's carrying around a lot of weight i don't
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know a whole lot of veterans but unfortunately with the scope of my job as a police officer i see the worst of
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people a number of people that i come into contact with that are prone to violence i find out are also veterans
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wow um it's too bad and it's unfortunate that's the correlation yeah it is you know you talk to the parents
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and you know they're like oh he wasn't always like this you know and it's really it's sad it
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really is sad that they have to carry around what they've seen because [ __ ] you see in war is not meant for
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human eyes we're just not built to withstand such trauma and to see rambo
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as far as i know is really the first movie her book because the book was written first was really the first
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character that displayed ptsd and addressed it not calling it ptsd because they didn't call it that back then but
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addressing the traumas that these guys have gone through yeah it was a really revolutionary at least the mainstream
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maybe something was delved into on some tv show on who knows from the 60s or 70s
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i don't know but we've seen it before where yeah a character has been damaged you know was in that book johnny grab
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his gun or whatever that book so there's definitely has been stories about characters suffering because of
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war but the idea what david morale did here i've i love that idea of bringing the war home so not just the
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post-traumatic stress but literally ramble brings the war on to american
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soil he brings that war back it carries like a ghost that follows you from house to house he carries his actual war
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to this poor small town like his inability to adjust back to civilian life yeah once he experienced
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the war he couldn't let it go amazing amazing story so here we go craig and i
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uh on our first episode we got to the part where rambo is about to enter the town of hope now of course this is
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actually a real town a real big town small city i guess you could say it's grown even since 1982 but it still
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exists here in british columbia my province that i live in hope british columbia have you ever been there you
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ever go to see the shooting locations have i ever been there yes i have well you drive through hope to go to alberta
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and we had a family in alberta so i did a couple times as a kid i think i remember my dad saying at one point
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when i was little because i didn't understand geography or whatever but i remember him saying like oh this is where rambo
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was filmed in my brain i was like rambo was here i remember kind of like looking around
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he's on the woods a little bit i'm kind of amazed but scared at the same time you know and but it's it's
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it's a few hours like i have to take a ferry from where i live to the mainland and then it's a bit of a drive so i
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haven't been there in a long time to say i am going to hope to look at the sites but i think now that i'm doing this
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podcast and obviously bc is my home province like your home state i'm definitely going to make a trip to hope
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now with the internet and everything it's going to be a lot easier to actually find the exact locations of where things were shot and stuff
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pre-internet i probably would have had a hard time trying to figure out where exactly was the cliff or where exactly was the
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yeah yeah because i live in new jersey which is a stone's throw away from philadelphia so i can drive an affiliate
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and see the rocky locations at any time yeah you lucky bastard i've only done it once though yeah it's
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just like in the rocky films you can run up the steps in philadelphia at the art museum well they also have the same
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exhibit for first blood you can go in the cliff and jump off of it or scale along the side of it yeah you
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get to fall in the tree and soap your own arm and everything yeah nice all right so rambo's about to walk into this
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town it's great because they actually got a place called hope now in the book it was um boy i forget now i think it
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was it was madison connecticut or something like that maybe boy i already got the tampa bay i know the town's name was madison because that's my daughter's
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name i guess it was like a central southern state it wasn't washington no it's not and so in the movie it's hope
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washington so it's definitely you can see the scenery specific northwest look to it but it's british columbia where it's
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film so obviously the scenery has changed a little bit than the the town of um madison
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i always think it's crazy like there's cars driving in and out of this town here now they have a film crew set up
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here but you got to figure this just people driving to and from work or whatever i always wondered that about movies yeah how much of the traffic do
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they block off and just have some stu not stunt cars but you know intentionally placed cars drive through
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for the aesthetic yeah there's a car coming towards sly you know on the other side of the road like there's somebody
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in that car driving in 82 do they say okay we want you to drive now it's probably just people it's probably early it looks like early morning you see the
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sun is a little bit low here so there's probably people just driving to and from whatever through the town and they just
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have a camera on the side of the road filming sly walk and it's just people like okay that's my van in the van yes
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like my fan was in rambo i guarantee you event i guarantee you saying my van wasn't ramble i would all right so now
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he's walked into town and now we cut to the incredible brian dennehy his skill
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as an actor is tremendous i don't even know what else to say he toes the line too because he's not all bad i don't
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think no i don't know if that's the intention and it's interesting what david morrell said about the teasel
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character kind of modeling him after his own stepfather after um morel's own
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stepfather and how rambo and teasel have that antagonistic relationship out of
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mistrust because that's how kind of how david morell felt about his own stepfather brian danny he plays sheriff
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will teasel now in the book forever asks exact age but i think rambo in the book
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is probably 21-22 and sheriff teasel is probably close to 40 not over 40 but old enough
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just that he could have been rambo's father by age like 20 years older in this movie now believe it or not brian
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dennehy doug i believe in this film is 46. they were closer
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and sly was 36. okay i thought they were even closer in age than that no we should also note that the film it
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takes place at 82 and the events i know we have listener of our show who thinks otherwise or used to listen to our show
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he thinks otherwise the events take place in 82. i can't remember if i talked about that with david or if it
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was with craig but just in general that it just makes more sense just to film in current time and i think it was david
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realm where sly is just he is older he's an older actor so he's 36. it's still
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believable that sly or the veteran rambo is older because in the book he's 21 20
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like he's just really has only recently left the war rambo has been out of the war now for
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you know seven eight years also i heard that in the book and part
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of the reason why they have this antagonistic relationship is because teasel was a veteran of the korean war
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yeah and rambo was a veteran of the vietnam war and teasel felt that the accomplishments
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of the americans in the korean war have been forgotten and everybody's focusing now on the veterans of the vietnam war
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and there's kind of a little bit of jealousy there because teasel believes like his contributions have been
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forgotten even though he was a well-decorated marine himself and that was a movie thing that wasn't a book thing it wasn't in the bucket no no he
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is a korean veteran and he actually has the second highest medal from the korean war teasel they're both soldiers and
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they're both veterans of war the main conflict was is how similar they were how accomplished they were in their own
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right but teasel never had a son and he wanted to have children and he was going through a divorce in the book because he
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wanted to have a child and his ex-wife to be didn't want to have kids and she was moving away or she moved away
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there's a whole side story of him trying to resolve things with his ex-wife to be he sees rambo partly as himself as a
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younger version of himself but also as somebody he could have fathered and helped and he has father issues as well so both teasel and ram will have father
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issues there's father issues abound in this book there's very little talk what the vietnam versus korean war meant it
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if it was i missed it completely there was very little discussion about what the vietnam vets were going through at the time the vietnam war was still going
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during the writing of this book it was still happening maybe it wasn't in deleted scenes then or something because it was never explicitly said but if i'm
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not mistaken later on in the movie you can see teasel's medals yeah when he uh gathered there i think he mentioned
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something about the korean war in first blood i mean it's been a little while since i've seen the whole film all the way through that like a long time probably a year or two but back to
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our first impression of teasel in this scene he's a very polite guy he's saying hi to the townspeople you would think in
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the town he's a recognized polite guy he's nice to the citizens he
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appears by all intents and purposes appears to be a good sheriff to his men a good boss yeah i want to get his age
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to confirm i believe he's 48 just looks older he does but people aged weird back in the 80s
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why is that i don't know not just the 80s even earlier than that because of all the smoking and the drinking that
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people did back then it just what's 82 he was born in 30 something right 38. he's 44
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jesus he's my age next month oh my gosh that'd be like you
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playing teasel oh mike i'm gonna cast doug greenberg as sheriff
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will tease with a remake you could be cast right now in the remake of ramble that is hilarious unlike rocky because
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rocky was created by special sloan so i get the connection that people have of never recasting or redoing the rocky
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films i get that it's sly's creation his images his
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from his brain came to character but to be fair to the ramble character sly put it into the popular culture stratosphere
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yes but he didn't create the character correct so rambo is not as sacred
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in the sense of it's not the quite the sacred cow that rocky is i think rambo and i have no problem with
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it look i actually don't have any problem with rocky being reboot in the sense of one day sly is going to die
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is he going to be live in 20 years unlikely it's a great story people can argue all you want about that and i know
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i'm maybe on the minority but part of me is like a good story is a good story and if you could retell that story with different people to a new generation
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they're still going to go back to the original it happens all the time people go back to like oh i want to see the one start i mean people went back to the original after seeing creed creed 1 and
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2 is like a reboot of the rocky series people watched creed one because it was a new film and they went back and
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watched the rocky films because of their love of creed yeah rocky got a whole new generation of fans exactly
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so i see this with the ramble films rambo by all means reboot it make it i think first blood quentin tarantino kind
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of teased that he wouldn't mind doing the first blood a quentin tarantino first blood would be unbelievable
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it would be nice i think that would be incredible yeah quentin said of course that he would follow closely the source
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material and the psychological drama the violence the book is incredibly violent
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it's a twin tarantino violent book a lot more killing that's for sure but if you put it in anybody's capable hands i
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would say his or as capable as anyone's [Music]
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yeah loving you know nice little music he kind of struts out of the the cops uh office and puts on his cowboy hat of
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course he's got yeah yeah he used to share with the american flag behind him like he's he's mr america right now it's
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incredible you know smiles takes in the morning there everybody's favorite sheriff right there
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well it is a small town he's been there his whole life and so he is a staple both as a resident and of course it's
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the highest ranking type law authority in town he is the law burped up his coffee and donuts there
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morning eddie how you doing girl all right this morning yeah so it is morning and you know saying hi to the hi
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the locals he knows that's annie yeah yep morning sheriff andy whale
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[Music] as you can see he put out his hat for a very short distance he put him on his
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head walked down the stairs and he gets into the stop cruiser takes it off again this has to be intentionally done to
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display that he's not just a cold-hearted bastard that's a miserable guy the town likes him he's not the
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sheriff bullying town townsfolk like people are saying hi to him he's a congenial nice nice individual who runs
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this is like the opening as a guy that loves westerns you should know like this is like the opening of a western yeah
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you know the sheriff walks out into the street and greets the town says hello to everybody as he's conducting his
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business and uh david morale said he wrote this is a western there you go perfect good morning dave
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hi sheriff guy wearing a hard hat just walking down the street i love him
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[Laughter] all right at some point sheriff you're
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gonna have to stop saying hi to people you're never gonna get you're gonna get your day started there's somebody walking by into your car you never said
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hi to him now he's gonna feel left out the whole day oh did you catch that one did you take a
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bath this week now we're already seeing this guy is at least a bit of a dick right there yeah
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he's trading barbs with the uh you know no but he didn't say it loud enough for him to hear we heard as an audience but
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i don't think that guy heard it he's walked away this week i think he stayed under his breath but we hear it as an audience member but dave doesn't hear it so he's
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a nice guy but kind of a dick yeah classic shot of the greyhound driving
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bias morning all right so now already sheriff teasel
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has greeted rambo just outside the city limits there i love the scenery shots all around these guys man yeah yes like
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every shot the mountains the clouds you just no cgi no green screen that's just real scenery everywhere it's a very
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pretty part of let's say america but it's canada yeah let's keep in mind that yes
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this story takes place in the us but everything you've seen is british columbia that's just because it's cheaper to film up there it's not
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for the scenery yeah all right i kid no it's true though you're right tax breaks or something they say um
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but it's beautiful there i mean we watch the state and oregon are beautiful states too but british columbia is a beautiful province it's actually on our
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license plate it says beautiful british columbia that's our tagline that's our moniker for our province yeah
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you uh visiting somebody around here [Music]
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you know wearing that flag on that jacket looking the way you do you're asking for trouble around here
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friend this was the one point with david morale i would say disagreed with him but i i showed him my understanding of
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this scene because he talked about when he saw this in the theaters with other long-haired individuals back in 82 and i
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know this was his generation having long hair when he was younger that was a big thing if you had long hair you were considered hippie anti-government all
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that stuff and or anti-establishment and that was what long hair meant now sly does have long hair here it's not like
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hair metal no rambo three long no beautiful ramble three but that being
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said uh in these clean shaven two of course the character in the book he has a beard and the hair is even a lot longer sly should have had a beard in
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this film that would have been more nighthawk sly than but it's a movie in that he's a star he
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wants to show his face he wants to show his mug let's be honest he's got a very handsome square jawed face here he's going to show it off that's the whole
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thing i think a movie today if it was made i think they would have foregone the vanity part of it and then the actor
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i guarantee you would have a beard in today's film so right away teasel says you know looking the way you do
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what i focus on all these years and it wasn't until the long-haired discussion in the book and then david morale talking about that i was like oh they're
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talking long hair that seems to be the big issue back then it was actually for me it was just like it says you know wearing that flag and wearing that
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jacket what does that mean to you as an american when you hear but the american flag i know what it represents obviously to different people from different ways
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but why is the flag so divisive in your own country i i mean now it's not okay
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now it's you know the symbol of of unity but back after the years following vietnam the veterans he looks
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like a vietnam vet yeah they wore those those field jackets and i don't know about the flags but in my mind the
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typical post-vietnam vet looked like rambo with the green jacket the long
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hair maybe a beard you know even possibly a headband that's like the grizzled old vietnam vet that you think
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of those guys weren't welcomed home from war with open arms maybe right off the
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bat teasel recognizes this him as a vietnam vet and his war is already forgotten what he's doing is profiling
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he has no right legal right to stop rambo and just because he's a stranger in his town he's profiling in him as
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somebody who looks suspicious did you find it interesting that delmar and his family live outside of town
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yeah right outside we don't want your folk in our town yeah seriously like
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i wondered about that i don't need it north or south north
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i love lagos you're heading north or south and ravel just arbitrarily picks north something wherever i'll jump in
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i'll make sure you're heading the right direction great acting there you know jump in i'll make sure you're heading the right
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direction huh the look on denny's face of course teasel's face is like you know what i'm talking about the direction out
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of my town but his presentation of it it comes off in a friendly way i know we've seen this movie before so we know where
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the character is heading but you just get that sense right away that boy teasel doesn't like this guy and
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he's already starting to push him already pushing him now in the book just so people know and maybe even in the movie but they don't talk about the
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movie but in the book rambo has gone to 15 different towns just like this one and he's been pushed and pushed and
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mistreated and it wasn't until this town that it broke him i think that's why
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and partly in this film he's less crazy in the film because we don't see the journey of rambo the character so much
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so he's more sympathetic even still in the book as crazy as you went you're still sympathizing a little bit because
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he's been spit upon and mistreated and everywhere he's gone in america and it wasn't until this time when he finally said because he has conversations with
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himself in his head he's like you could have let this one go you could have let this one go like you did in the other towns but you wanted this fight you
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wanted to show them what you could do and that was the conversation that rambo has with himself that he kind of wanted to show teasel what he was capable of in
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this film after he's arrested he's actually abused by the police did any of that happen in the other towns or was
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the abuse really what triggered him you know he got verbally abused and kind of mishandled by not just police but the
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public you know the street people were attacked him and stuff so he was everywhere he went no matter
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law enforcement to public to homeless people he just got harassed so he just broke that's the bane of the vietnam vet
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yeah at that time so he doesn't verbally comply with like kind of there's a mini sigh there and he goes okay i'll hit
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i'll jump into the cruiser i mean in his mind maybe he's saying like a town that doesn't want me yeah he could be saying
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that right now like what is going through his mind right now it's hard to say but he does get into the cruiser
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where you headed portland portland is south you said you were heading north
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i love that little moment there i i catch it every time so tesla says you know here you said you're going north but portland south and then
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rabble just goes no [Laughter] he doesn't explain what the no is for
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like did you catch that i didn't but watch it again watch it again it's such a weird little moment
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you say no i didn't say i was going tell me what he's saying no to where you headed
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portland portland is south you said you were headed north
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what does he say no to yeah i don't know he says no yeah
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now there's a couple theories i have because it's editing right now apparently there's a three and a half
27:02
hour cut of this film that's sly hated right did you hear about that yeah i i did against
27:08
everything that we've come to know about sly he wanted his part cut yes now i'm wondering so maybe in this
27:15
conversation here teasel said something to how all to say no because there's a line he just rolls right into another
27:21
line right after that little no so maybe it would have been too weird to edit because he says no and then he starts talking about
27:27
something else so maybe they thought oh crap where did we put this no there might have been a longer conversation in the car right because he rolls right
27:33
into another piece of dialogue it would have been too choppy to edit the no and then have him start talking so that's one theory or he's just like being
27:39
dismissive saying no it does it doesn't matter it doesn't matter what i said or where we're going he just wants to have a bite to eat right sly is an
27:45
interesting character and i love him but boy is he interested and he's complicated and i wonder what that uh three and a half hour cut was like
27:51
because he said that if anyone saw it it would have destroyed his career yeah he hated his his own performance so much
27:57
it's weird what happened in that cut it's not described is it he just no he just long cut he hates it we've i don't
28:04
think he's ever seen the light of day so weird he tried to buy the rights to the film so he could have it destroyed yeah
28:10
i just hope we still get to see the three and a half hour cut of party kitty and studs that's what i'm hoping for you always go for the kitty and stud joke
28:17
everything i can eat around here there's a diner about 30 miles up the highway
28:24
30 miles wow he wants him 30 miles how how long does
28:29
it take you to walk 30 miles oh quite a while and of course ramble's like are you kidding me like he's realizing oh this guy does not want me in this town
28:36
and he's thinking of course i'm an american citizen i fought for this country this is what's already going through his mind what's going on here am
28:43
i not allowed to walk freely in my country and that's a very good question why can't he freely like what is this north korea what's teasel's problem with
28:50
him and what's everybody's problem with him okay just because he's a veteran of an unpopular does that mean that he's
28:56
gonna wreak havoc in your town in the book teasel talks about he's run into people like him before this is an issue
29:01
that happened in the states during the time that hippies were picked up by cops that's what david morales genesis of the
29:06
book was too that he saw it on the news that people were literally picked up by police no offense to you as a police officer but this was
29:12
obviously the 70s they were picked up by police they were shaving haircuts and like they changed their can you imagine
29:18
arresting someone and shaving their head doug no that's what they did back then it's a time that's long 50 forgotten
29:25
thank god people were afraid of the cops back then because the cops dulled out serious punishments yeah they were the law and
29:32
the trial judge and and everything and they carried out the punishments themselves and you got to figure tesla 2
29:38
sees a competent person here this is a he's no slouch you can tell he's stiff-backed square jaw he's a veteran
29:45
he's younger than teasel being a veteran himself he sees danger he kind of recognizes diatezal recognizes danger he
29:52
recognizes somebody who carries himself in a way this guy he's bad news and he's not wrong so teasel is profiling anybody's also not
29:59
wrong like his profile is correct now rambo had he just gotten a bite to eat would have left town
30:05
we know that we know that he just would have left town he would have gone to his 17th town and maybe there he would have
30:10
lost his marbles if somebody else pushed him again he got pushed too much here
30:16
is there any law against me getting something here yeah me right there i'm the law that says you
30:23
can't eat here this is his town yeah he's the police judging jury that's right
30:28
[Music] why are you pushing me i just love that bird can you imagine
30:34
this conversation really happening but i love it why are you pushing me and it's the first time he turns and
30:40
looks teasel in the eye too he was looking straight ahead and one word answers and everything and
30:45
and the second he feels he's being pushed now he turns and this is where they're antagonistic
30:52
it was kind of subtle before you know i'll make sure you're going the right direction yeah there's a diner 30 miles away so the rap was like okay dude what
30:58
the f's your problem but i love that term instead of saying what's your problem that's a great way to say why are you pushing me i love that term
31:05
instead that's a great way of saying that yeah yeah what did you say
31:11
so why are you pushing me i haven't done anything to you first of all you don't ask the questions around here i do you understand
31:16
secondly we don't want guys like you in this town
31:22
[Music] drifters first thing you know we got a whole bunch of guys like you in this town
31:28
that's why besides you wouldn't like it here this is
31:35
it's a quiet little town in fact you might say it's boring
31:41
but that's the way we like it you know when he says i ask the questions around here and that's
31:46
everything that i hate about police today okay you're speaking as an officer yeah
31:53
nobody knows what kind of cop i am because i don't talk about it much but in my
31:58
career i started off like this where instead of being that guy that wants to
32:03
confront everybody with i wear the badge i'm the law i call the shots
32:08
you actually listen you listen to what the people have to say and then you adjust the way you react to
32:15
it based on the way they handle it if you're encountering everybody you say no no i ask the questions you answer what i
32:22
what i'm asking you what kind of response do you think you're going to get from that guy well you're not was it serving the public correct me if i'm
32:28
wrong but your job as a police officer is is to keep the peace is to you know to keep it to keep the
32:34
peace don't antagonize people you're talking to because you're probably dealing with a lot of mental health issues too you're dealing with people
32:40
that are i mean i feel bad for you guys because you're dealing with people at their worst and you guys aren't trained
32:46
doctors or psychologists your job is to protect the public too so you're basically saying hey this guy is off his
32:52
rocker or whatever my with your drugs alcohol or mental illness or both or everything yeah sometimes you gotta handcuff him
32:59
and just take him away or her away from this so they're not hurting other people like it's just and you gotta be tough
33:05
yeah but at the same time i i totally agree with you saying if you're pulling to someone for a speeding ticket you know and the guy says oh was that going
33:11
over was that going hey i asked the questions here i will let you like whoa whoa you pulled me over i think already
33:17
put this poor guy on it's like i'm just wondering why you're pulling me over sir like like i have a right as a taxpayer
33:22
to know why the hell an officer has pulled me over this is a scary moment for me as a citizen just let me know why you pulled me over he
33:29
could say oh just so you know there's your taillight sellers want to make sure you're saying oh thank you sir that's very kind of you it's normal for us to
33:35
ask why are you in my face it's completely true and there's there's still i don't know how many sheriff
33:40
teasels there are out there just still quite a few i'm sure but we are as police throughout the country not just
33:46
you know my small department we're getting a lot more training in de-escalation techniques and
33:53
tactics and instead of escalating a situation we try to use calm tones and and questions and stuff to de-escalate a
34:00
situation and i'm sure you know and all your listeners know that police violence is a is a sore subject
34:07
these days we're really throughout the country are taking the right steps towards limiting that i'm proud of you
34:14
there honestly and i actually had you on this episode because i knew this would come up because teasel this is the first
34:19
introduction tease i wanted you know my friend who's a sergeant police force to be here to see mannerisms that teasels
34:25
here and you're saying for the record this is not good police work no i would i would i could honestly say as the
34:32
technical advisor of this podcast this is not no i mean we could get into
34:37
it later like how i as a police officer would handle this is why you're here yeah yeah the way he encountered him
34:43
is fine you know he pulls up to him uh hi how you doing today visiting somebody
34:49
i think he loses him when he attacks the way he looks i would keep asking him more questions you know where you're
34:55
headed oh you're headed to portland you know somebody there you have family there he's okay in giving him offering
35:01
him a ride to the edge of town or whatever okay are you allowed to do that are you allowed to give people rights yeah sure i actually didn't know yeah i
35:07
wouldn't put him in the front seat though fair enough you know you take him to the edge of town once he asks can i get something to
35:14
eat i mean i wouldn't try to discourage that yeah you want something to eat i can direct you into to the best spot in town
35:21
i'd drive them there drop them off you know if you're suspicious of the guy maybe you stay close
35:27
like you let him go in but you hang down the street just uh just for a little bit to make sure that there's no issues
35:33
inside but there's no reason to escalate situation the way teasel does yeah well
35:38
it wasn't doug greenberg that picked up john rambo i find asking questions and like trying
35:44
to get to know somebody you can ask him i mean maybe not asking about the war but you know the way he's trust me like
35:49
oh you you're in nam i served in korea yeah yeah yeah exactly that's another big tactic is relating to
35:55
somebody with your own personal experiences yeah let's continue this conversation and i get paid to keep it that way
36:01
[Music] boring oh yeah i want to say he's he senses
36:07
that danger course in rambo so he's like you know you could you don't want to be here this is not a playground that you
36:12
want to play in this is just a a boring town nothing to see here there's no game
36:17
for you to hunt here there's nothing here that's going to excite you you you need danger you need excitement he's
36:22
always twisting the back on rambo saying you'll find more excitement somewhere else go yeah go to portland you'll find
36:28
lots of excitement in portland so much bigger town but then rambos is boring and he kind of looks down there's a part of him i would
36:35
say he probably wants boring but all he's seen is drama and action and terrifying things yeah he wants boring
36:41
and so the idea here i think it hits him a little bit where he's saying you know you're trying to sell me boring
36:46
as a bad thing but actually that's what i'm looking for i'm looking for boring i don't want drama that's my question why
36:52
are you pushing me i actually just want a peaceful meal and move on maybe he wants he's in search of a place
36:58
to plant roots yeah exactly start a family have little ramblings
37:04
so this is a great shot here of the bridge that the police cruiser drives across so this would be a spot i would have to visit and hope that bridge the
37:10
classic scene where he drops off rambo [Music] portland straight ahead
37:18
now i love how he says portland straight ahead rambo gets out of the car but then tesla turns on the lights what's up that
37:23
all about why would he turn on the lights getting ramble out of the car if you stop in the middle of traffic yeah you'd want to turn the lights on to
37:29
alert the other cars but there's nobody around i don't know what that purpose is i think it might be just to tell
37:35
roundtable yeah like okay this is a police matter now like i've dumped you off your as a police officer not as a
37:41
friend maybe right if you want some friendly advice a haircut and take a bath
37:47
you wouldn't get hassled so much so right there he says it was plain as day yeah you don't want to get hassled you
37:53
know look like the establishment look like a government fbi boy he has to get in that one last dig
37:59
he doesn't want your advice yeah spread the advice we're talking about it's friendly advice you're just giving him one last shot you
38:06
almost had him you almost had him out of your town but you had to mess with him one last time and i love how he says you
38:12
know you want some friendly advice get a job oh really you want you you want to be a homeowner buy a home okay yeah
38:19
sure hope this ride helped you out
38:26
and here comes some sly's great quiet silence said i hope this ride helped you out he
38:33
drives ready have a nice day huh oh you bet there sir yeah you have a good day too so now teasel's driving back to town
38:39
yeah so teasel's driving away haven't i stayed there mr ramble off he goes but this sequence is coming up of course our
38:44
listeners can't see it but they've seen the film a hundred times i'm sure all of our listeners are big first blood fans the sequence that will be coming up is
38:51
just so well done it's just amazing how it's shot [Music]
38:57
ramble looks yeah ramble looks uh at the cruiser drive away
39:03
faces it and i love this moment because he's thinking do i go out of town or do i go
39:10
back he's actually thinking and in the book this is actually the discussion he's having in his head of course he can't do this in a movie the thoughts in
39:16
his head but acted very well we know exactly what ramble's singing here
39:21
choices decisions this is and this here is is one of sly's strengths as an actor
39:27
because he does portray that that internal conflict a little bit if i walk away especially after what told me about
39:33
the book if i walk away i can go to another town and get treated the same way or i can make a stand and stick up
39:39
for myself exactly
39:47
and this is that music cue collar yeah listen that music dude so right there he lifts up his
39:52
collar he's made his decision that's a great music cue from jerry goldsmith and that's why knowing the book's a little bit helpful because because he's pissed
39:59
now like he knows by going back he's going to start a war he's made that decision face right now yeah it's awesome yeah
40:05
before leading up to this he had that quiet contemplation look about earlier
40:11
and now he's flipping his collar he's kind of flipped his uh switch so to
40:16
speak you can see some anger in his eyes
40:22
he's not gonna put up with it anymore and the thunder that that you hear right
40:28
before this is like the you know that the the coming storm
40:34
ravel just crosses the bridge just enough diesel sees the ruby mirror not even that surprised really he's not even
40:39
that surprised that he's coming back to town and so now diesel great confrontation coming up
40:48
diesel's done playing the nice guy quarter court nice guy yeah you think you're going
40:54
hey i'm talking to you goddamn now this as a police officer would
41:00
aggravate me if you're addressing somebody and they just walk past you like you don't even exist you know god
41:05
damn well you hear me did he call him an a-hole there though did i catch i don't know
41:12
where the hell do you think you're going hey i'm talking to you god damn
41:23
they see some id [Music] all right whoo that musical cue put your
41:28
hand at him so he grabs him let me see some id and grab some what do you do in this situation doug oh you don't just
41:34
try to grab somebody like that you stop him i would stand in front of him to try to like interrupt his progress maybe put
41:41
my hands up you don't grab somebody by the wrist that's just asking for trouble now in the book it's really amazing he
41:46
talks about how in this confrontation in the book he has a lot of inner dialogue
41:51
because at this moment he knows that he could actually destroy teasel right now bare hand talks about how he could rip
41:57
his spine out of his back break him in five different places all this grab his gun and blow him like all these things you just hear what he can do the images
42:04
in his mind of rambo is a very accomplished killer very accomplished but he holds back so right now this is
42:09
rambo holding back he's allowing teasel to a degree to do what he's doing here it's a game now for
42:15
rambo a little bit yeah so teasel grabs his arm rambo pulls back and now teasel believes
42:21
right away grabs for his weapon or puts his hand on his holster well the way rambo rips his arm away it's not just a
42:27
show of defiance he's actually violently rips his hand away and kind of takes a an offensive stance
42:34
oh yeah he's ready to fight yeah all right you're under arrest what at this point is he under arrest
42:40
for i guess he could get him for obstruction of justice i mean he's not preventing any admission
42:46
of the law it's tough but yeah that is tough i mean he disobeyed your
42:52
unlawful order to get out of town i i really don't know what what are you arresting him for yeah i don't want to
42:57
put you on the spot because this is a tricky situation because now teasel's made it his deal to to stop him from
43:03
coming to town and rambles doesn't want to obey that order from the law but i mean is it against the law
43:10
firm to come back to town like is that a law that you can't come to town or you can't lawfully throw somebody out of
43:15
your town i mean they book him later for vagrancy vagrancy isn't illegal at least
43:21
in new jersey right i don't know if it is anywhere but just be it must have been at some point you know wanderer
43:26
isn't illegal if i'm walking on the street this is like essentially what he's doing right now he's walking i mean really in the
43:32
wilderness almost it just happens to be a paved road there so he's walking back to town do i really have to stop because
43:37
you told me to stop now 1982 laws are clearly different nowadays but
43:43
now you can get out of your car and speak to anybody you don't have to have a lawful purpose but to stop them to
43:50
detain them to stop their travel they're just walking but to stop them to say like oh come here let's let
43:57
me talk to you for a second you need a lawful purpose to do that yeah you could say hey how you doing and if the guy
44:02
chooses to stop and engage with you and talk to you then it's perfectly lawful but once you prevent them from leaving
44:08
once you say no like i'm going to ask you some questions and you're going to answer them you have to have a lawful purpose to do that i have a reason to
44:14
believe you're a dangerous person maybe that's what teasel thinks maybe he thinks he's dangerous to be fair to tease a little bit i'm not trying to
44:19
throw him under the bus so maybe he's he's made it a war i understand that but at this moment he maybe he feels like
44:25
rambo has some dangerous intentions for his town so you could argue that that he is trying to protect his town that his intention though as the antagonist of
44:31
the film isn't horrible he does see a dangerous he senses right away he knows
44:36
this guy's dangerous by the way he reacts to it like oh boy the way he ripped my arm off from his arm boy this guy is strong he knows how to respond to
44:44
contact i would say teaser's probably a little bit i say afraid at this moment too but he's like oh i have a wild animal here yeah his his sense is kind
44:51
of peak here you hear me put your hands on the car now you put your hands in the car and you spread them
44:57
now you're gonna put your hands on that car how you do it you decide right now he
45:02
puts his hand on his gun says you know you're gonna put your hands in the car and how you do it you know it's gonna happen you can either do it willingly or
45:08
i'll shoot you again 1982 might be different but you can't you can't do that you can't
45:14
threaten somebody with a death no no because right now ramble's just standing there there's no indication
45:20
that he's going to do anything violent he's just standing well okay let's assume that this is a lawful stop and he
45:25
does have a law enforcement reason to arrest rambo here rambo refusing to put
45:31
his hands on the car it's resisting arrest it's grounds for at that point you can put your hands on the gun now you can take a defensive tactics
45:37
approach to arresting the guy that doesn't mean slapping him with your billy stick or open field tackle right
45:44
there's a very thin line between affecting an arrest and going overboard so in the book again this is where i
45:50
think it's at this point exactly where rambo is like i can kill him right now but i won't so that's what's going through his head i think in the film is
45:56
we don't see the thoughts but keep in mind the character that was created by david morales ramble could have killed diesel right
46:03
here but he doesn't he says he would have been able to grab that gun before he could have drawn it i'm glad that you read that that you have the knowledge of
46:08
the book to kind of explain what's going on through rambo's mind yeah because that was one when i when i was reading
46:14
the rocky 2 novel getting into rocky's head was one of my main purposes yeah find out what's going on rambo is more
46:21
even more complex character than rocky's a little sigh that he does right there okay look at his eyes change he doesn't
46:26
have that anger in him anymore yeah he's like okay i'm not going to kill him yeah
46:31
get your legs back hey try to be nice to some people
46:39
nice so he starts frisking on you try to be nice to some people you can kind of sense he's almost kind of relieved that
46:45
rambo's not fighting right now as a police officer i would handcuff him before i search him good point i didn't
46:51
even catch that yeah his hands are just on the car but you'd want to have his hands not free to just turn around start
46:57
strangling you or whatever yeah yeah we have here huh
47:03
why would you be carrying a knife like this so he pulls out the big hunty knife now again this knife was not in the book
47:08
dave morrell talks about that this prop was something that sly wanted he always likes to fidget and have stuff in his
47:13
hand which explains rocking the ball by the way for the rocky films he always uh still likes to fidget
47:18
and have things in his hands he wanted that knife for the character and so that was a sly addition to the film having
47:24
that problem good edition it just got on to become an iconic knight yeah much like the boxing gloves and rocky the
47:29
knife is pretty iconic with a ramble american yeah you know teasel and she's the knife says why why do you have a knife like this
47:37
hunting i love the answer what do you hunt here you go don't be a wise guy
47:42
what do you hunt with a knife damn it love that name it in his mind you think
47:47
he's thinking people oh yeah or at the same time he's like i'm capable of hunting anything name it man beast
47:53
doesn't matter i'll hunt it that's it so the next sequence of events is police station the processing that's what you
47:59
guys call it right yeah processing now you gave me this section of the movie i'm sure if i'm invited back i'll be
48:05
back for later soon of course you're inviting me yeah sorry you uh you really bombed this uh
48:10
it was an audition yeah and this is the kind of thing when i was a kid that seemed boring to me but this
48:17
few minutes that we watch is chock full of emotion tension that we see between the two
48:22
characters emotions and and that contemplation that's going through rambo's mind that and i know this
48:28
breaking down a movie minute by minute watching in such small chunks you really get to analyze to a great
48:35
degree moments like that that's why i love these little uh bits that i do and that you do oh man was awesome having
48:42
you on if you haven't already folks check out doug's rocky minute podcast you guys are covering rocky iii right now on the last
48:48
of the action heroes podcast network doing a great job of course you're one of the top shows man your show is very
48:53
popular and the rifle is so i check every month i check to see how the rocky minutes are due they're usually one of
48:59
them more listened to yeah episodes well brock is a really preacher yeah rock is a popular character and people love
49:04
those first six films so it's amazing to see you're doing great work a great hard journey ahead of you you'll be done the
49:09
rocky films what 10 years maybe or oh i don't think i'll ever get back to releasing five a week but i want to get
49:15
back to doing at least two or three a week i can't wait for my episodes to drop how was the uh vicky death scene
49:20
you were the mickey death scene yeah i can't wait look
49:26
i love it all right brother anything else you want to plug before we uh say goodbye uh what about our combination
49:32
project the sylvester stallone fan podcast that we do with our buddy craig so check that out again on the last of
49:37
the action heroes podcast i think it's about 30 plus episodes we've done yeah wow yeah where we cover
49:43
sly films that are neither ramble or rockies that's a fun so if you're a stallone fan you're listening to this podcast because you're a ramble fan but
49:48
you're like yeah i like other stone films just google sylvester stallone podcast it's on the same network feed
49:54
you can see it there we cover stuff like from escape plans expendables to lock up to victory all those films cobra we
50:00
covered it at all we sell more do i think our next one would be escape plan three so get ready for that one i think we're done with all the good
50:06
ones we are officially oh we still have rhinestone to do so me oh that's great
50:13
thanks everyone thanks for watching so that's the end the episode's over nothing is over nothing you just don't
50:18
turn it off
50:24
[Music]
50:44
so [Music]
50:59
you